"Both in One Trench"
Ray: Sammi provides us with a follow up meeting between a Pakistani cleric and the Vice President of Iraq. The main topic is establishment of a secret relationship between the Taliban and Iraq through Iraqi Intelligence apparatus for the purpose of assisting each other against the United States. Context: before the Taliban took full control of Kandahar, there were several factions fighting to gain power. There is another document at the FMSO website in which Saddam and his ministers discuss Afghanistan and how the different factions are vying for control. These meetings lend very strong support to the conclusion that the Taliban sought Iraq's support to not only take and maintain control in Afghanistan but to be an allie against the U.S. and that Iraq chose to support the Taliban.
Sammi: Translator’s notes:
-The diary is 76 pages on the computer screen. Many screens cover 2 pages in the diary. -The diary belongs to someone called Khaled Abd El Majid and covers events taking place in 1999 since the diary is for the year 1999 (Page 3/76).
-On page 5/76 he has a note reminding him of a “Meeting with Mr. Taha Yassin Ramadan” with the house’s phone number. Ramadan is the vice-president of Iraq from March 1991 to the fall of Saddam Hussein in 2003.
- There are two important meetings with a Pakistan Islamic cleric named Fadl Ur Rahman. His plan is to establish relations between Baghdad and the Taliban. The second meeting is taking place on 28/11/1999.
-The Pakistani is not from Taliban but in contact with them.
-The diary is hand written which makes it sometimes difficult to read.
-Since Arabic is written from right to left, the meeting starts on page 20/76 and ends on page 17/76.
-In 28/11/1999 Ossama had already struck the two US Embassies in Africa and officially declared war on America.
- In 28/11/1999 Ossama was already in Afghanistan, hosted by the Taliban regime.
This is the translation of the second meeting.
Meeting of Mr. M. O. M. with Sheikh Maulana Fadl Ur Rahman on Sunday 28/11, 7:45 PM
Words of welcoming.
-We are aiming to arrange a meeting between you and Mr. President Leader (translator’s note: this is how Iraqi officials call Saddam). But in the beginning we were instructed that Mr. Vice-President will meet you. (translator’s note: this is the proof that the “Vice-President” of the first meeting was the VP of Saddam, Taha Yassin Ramadan)
-: I personally met Hekmatyar (translator’s note: an Afghani warlord fighting the Taliban) and he asked us to interfere for the possibility of closer relations with the Taliban. And he sent us emissaries concerning this issue. (translator’s note: On the original document Fadl Ur Rahman is not is saying this sentence for the simple reason that Fadl’s name is quoted at the beginning of the following sentence. It is probably M.O. M.the Iraqi official. It is not mentioned where the meeting of M.O.M. and Hekmatyar took place)
- Fadl Ur Rahman: I am the one who started with this issue, the relation between Taliban and Iraq and it is our idea. The brothers in Afghanistan are facing the pressure of America, and are struggling against America and aim to have some connections between Afghanistan and Iraq and it is a good start to establish the relations with Iraq and Libya and our association has taken this responsibility upon her. I already met with Mr. the Vice-President and the previous head of the directorate may God rest his soul (translator’s note: apparently the head of the directorate passed away) and both proposed that Hekmatyar and the Taliban should get to an agreement. I spoke with the Taliban about this issue and they started meeting with delegations from the Islamic Party and I met Mullah Omar and his reply was positive.
As a front (translator’s note: front as party) our stand is that there should be an agreement between the Taliban and the rest of the opposition, Shah Ahmad Massoud and Rabbani.
And Mullah Omar said that we are looking towards this and that (not clear) and (not clear) and Ahmad Al Kilani and Jalal Al Din Hakkani do not oppose us. Therefore Hekmatyar is on the positive way but we are in a war situation and that needs a lot of trust and there are hurdles to this because he fought us and killed us and he has problems with the opposition in the North and with us. After repeated contacts we will reach an agreement but in the form of steps. Concerning the relations with Iraq he said that they are our brothers and Muslims and are facing pressures from America, like us and like Sudan and Libya. And he (Mullah Omar) desires to get closer relations with Iraq and that Iraq may help us in reducing our problems. Now we are facing America and Russia. He requested the possibility of Iraq intervening to build a friendship with Russia since Russia is no more the number one enemy. And we request Iraq’s help from a brotherly point of view. They are ready for this matter and they prefer that the relation between Iraq and Taliban be an independent relation from Hekmatyar’s relation with the Taliban.
We want practical steps concerning this issue and specially the relationship with Taliban and (not clear but could be Iraq).
An Iraqi (most probably M.O.M.): I want to discuss three points.
The first is the relation with Taliban. It should be understood that this issue is completely independent from the mediation requested by Hekmatyar to get to an agreement with the Taliban. Developing the relation with Taliban is essential and this development requires meetings to create a common ground of understanding. We already believe that there are no points of disagreement between us and the Taliban because we are both in one trench facing the world’s oppression. But the details of the relation and its management are linked to the facts of the international situation. I find that by simply meeting with you (Fadl Ur Rahman) is a step forward in the relation with Taliban because we know well how much they trust you and what you represent for them. And when you relay our point of view for them they will understand it. For the future we think that we will arrange relations between us, as an intelligence service, and them in a SECRET (translator’s emphasis) way to establish the strong base of this relation. In the meeting (translator’s note: future meeting) and after reviewing the Taliban’s point of view, we would discuss the possibility of us making an effort to stabilize the situation between Taliban and Russia. We could discuss the subject through the intelligence channel. We look forward to security and stability in Afghanistan, the control of the Taliban and the construction of a political system according to the political and ideological choices of the Taliban. We look forward to assure the Russians that Afghanistan does not constitute a threat to Russia. Afghanistan is a country that wants to live in independence and by dialogue it is possible to reach common grounds to finally get to the result hoped for.
The second point is the subject of the agreement between Hekmatyar and the Taliban.
We proposed it for a single reason related to our psychological stand concerning Taliban. We hope that they will win and control. We felt that Hekmatyar hopes that Taliban will control the situation and his intentions are true. Because when he sees the different political and military parties in Afghanistan he knows that the best choice is Taliban.
(translator’s note: the Iraqi continues to expand his view on how all parties should come together through trust and negotiations.)
The third point which is important for us is outside Afghanistan. It is the spiritual relation which ties us with the Association of Islamic Scholars and we know your role in supporting the Iraqi cause and the effect you have on the Pakistani street. In the coming two weeks we are going to a confrontation with America because the US has put all its weight in the security Council to publish the Dutch-British resolution. We refuse this resolution and view it as a life long embargo. We look to our Muslim brothers in particular to support us and especially our brothers in the Association of Islamic Scholars to organize protests in Pakistan against the resolution when it is made official. We ask our Muslim brothers in Pakistan to do this effort. We are trying and we have contacts with Muslims all over Asia and especially in Pakistan, Indonesia, Malaysia, Bangladesh and India. We hope that during the two coming weeks you will ask our friends in those associations to demonstrate.
Fadl Ur Rahman: Concerning the relations between the Taliban and Iraq I was informed that they are going to start those relations in a SECRET (translator’s emphasis) manner and they are waiting for the answer and I will inform them that you will answer them through the embassy (translator’s note: could be through the Iraqi embassy of Kabul, if they had one or Islamabad-Pakistan). Concerning the agreement with Hekmatyar we are going to proceed with this issue. Concerning the third point the Association of Islamic Scholars has a popular voice in Pakistan and we will always side with Iraq and we hope that the new government (probably the Pakistani government) will have a positive stand with Iraq.
Last July we received information that America wants to attack Afghanistan because of Ossama Ben Laden so we did a (not clear) and agreed to contact Taliban to be sure and they said it was true. We received information about CIA and US commandos reaching the Pakistan-Afghanistan border and they started dropping bombs on Afghanistan and they used the Pakistani airfields to bomb important positions in Kandahar. We as a Muslim people do not accept the American presence on our soil. A representative from the US embassy came and told me “You said that America was your enemy, how can you say that we are your enemy and the enemy of Islam?” So I told them that you took Russia’s role in bombing Afghanistan and you are bombing Muslims. Then they said that they wanted Ossama so I told them that Ossama is in Sudan and that he was in Afghanistan during the rule of Rabbani and I added that they do not have a treaty to hand over criminals, as they pretend, with Afghanistan. And they are proposing to form a council of Muslim scholars from Saudi Arabia, Pakistan and other Islamic countries to study the issue of handing over Ben laden and what is the Islamic position about it.
I also told them that we have the Kashmiri problem and you are putting pressure on us to solve this problem through dialogue and without weapons. Also (not clear) you request dialogue between Palestine and Israel so how is it that concerning Ossama you use military force. The issue here is not Ossama Ben Laden but your interests require you to find a submissive government in Afghanistan to transform it into a trade zone in Central Asia.
All original tranlsations by "Sammi" are copyrighted intellectual property of "Sammi" for purposes of print media publishing. Free use for internet sources.
Ace has a "Bush was right" song
The Jawa Report with more on Iraq documents